PvP Wishlist.

[Kuru]

>Hard to cancel Machina
>Kidney Blow break 3k SA
>Kidney Blow AOE big
Are you even playing this new patch? Beyond The Wall SA already removed. What do you mean by hard to cancel? All lifting skills could cancel all Machina's skills. Assuming by the AOE skills she has, I don't think its hard to run away from. Kidney Blow AOE isn't that big like its covering half the map like glacial field, reverse gravity, lagma wave, black hole, etc..

>Machina High HP
180k HP is high? Have you tasted awakening skills' damage? How much ticks it has per sec? How long its cooldown? How much AOE it covers?

>Insane Utility
>High defense
Which of all the skills she have is utility? Fly By can be chased by dash, BTW has no SA, Air Shove have bad animation, Wallop has long cooldown. Which is it again?

If you have ever played Ruina, you'll know the truth of free killing her after baiting her 2 evades. It is not a blatant lie if you aren't a bad pvp-er or ignorant.

I feel like there is some intense victim complex here of "My class is so weak" while you're just disregarding how strong it is.

I never said Kidney blow had lots of SA, but at the same time it has enough SA that getting close to it will easily result in death due to it's ya know... 3k SA break. Also, let's mention lariat which has 600 SA, instant cast, breaks 600 SA, is faster than dash, drags the enemy in a knockback state so they can't counter. Lariat is easily the strongest initiator in the game but clearly that's not important right? But hey, if you think machinas are easy to cancel then you've probably never fought from the other side and you've probably just been bodied on your Ruina multiple times in the past then you've made the assumption "RUINA SO HARD".

You also mention that the "AOE isn't that big", you then proceed to mention skills from ranged classes (3/4 of which were sorcs and i mean, when you're trying to emphasize how SMALL your AoE is, it's not smart to compare it to the class with the largest known AoE in the game) when Kidney blow has is a melee skill. You're essentially saying "My turtle doesn't fly like my bird does so clearly Bird > Turtle". For a skill with 3k SA break, it's got a decent amount of AoE and is stupidly strong.

180k is actually higher than most HP values in this game, the only HP values higher are Guardian (A tank class) and Barbarian (186k, also tanky). So i don't know where you get the idea that 180k is low but if you ever ventured out of your little bubble of machina ignorance you'd realize that your class has more HP and Def than most. But no, by all means go play an archer and tell me how high their HP is, or play a sorc, or an academic, or a sin... You get the picture yet? Machina HP is one of the highest in the game and claiming otherwise is just blatant ignorance.

"Wallop has a long cooldown" okay so like, i know I mentioned that you never step out of your machina bubble but I've really got to do it again here. The counter CDs in the game are as follows:

- Crisis Howl (60 seconds)
- Counter Slash (40 seconds)
- Counter Exile (45 seconds)
- Cancel Circle Shot (45 seconds)
- Flaming Revenant (40 seconds)
- Avenging Wave (30 Seconds)
- Flash Grenade (22 seconds)
- Hypnosis (45 seconds)
- Quicks (45 seconds)
- Buzz Off (45 seconds)

(If you wanna hop on Shooting star or Priest and tell me about Utility then by all means~)

So, how does Wallop have a "long cooldown"? Maybe you should play a class beyond machina to understand how broken machina is. Air shove is good utility, It holds you in the air to defend against multiple attacks where as all other parry skills defend against one attack (except SoF which requires some expenditure to continue blocking) So, pray tell on how those skills are lacking in utility.
Also, yes Fly-by is great utility, regardless of its SA considering it be instantly cancelled into Beat down, Lariat, Flying Knee Kick etc etc. The amount of options you have from a single skill is obscene and quite frankly, stupid. And no, you can't chase fly-by with dash since it moves faster than dash and you can fly-by indefinitely.
Then you have Lariat, the be all and end all of initiations. Then you've got Gear Step and Duck (which reduces Gear Step CD by 90% meaning you'll have a long af AS boost as long as you know how to rotate your skills) to counter, combo and all around decimate people's SA.
THEN you have your Overclock, which is arguably the best heal in the game at 3% every second, meaning you'll get 100% HP after 33 seconds of healing. If you know how to space yourself properly then that's not very hard to achieve. In that time, Saint's great heal wouldn't even be off CD.


Your class is broken. Deal with it. You'd know that if you weren't a bad pvp-er or ignorant

[Reyzha7]

My Wish :
Make PvP back like 40 or 50cap
No EX or EXi
No Awakening
Dash only for Warrior

Yes it's a wish, can't i dream it? :v

[En Jin (Engine)]

I feel like there is some intense victim complex here of "My class is so weak" while you're just disregarding how strong it is.

I never said Kidney blow had lots of SA, but at the same time it has enough SA that getting close to it will easily result in death due to it's ya know... 3k SA break. Also, let's mention lariat which has 600 SA, instant cast, breaks 600 SA, is faster than dash, drags the enemy in a knockback state so they can't counter. Lariat is easily the strongest initiator in the game but clearly that's not important right? But hey, if you think machinas are easy to cancel then you've probably never fought from the other side and you've probably just been bodied on your Ruina multiple times in the past then you've made the assumption "RUINA SO HARD".

You also mention that the "AOE isn't that big", you then proceed to mention skills from ranged classes (3/4 of which were sorcs and i mean, when you're trying to emphasize how SMALL your AoE is, it's not smart to compare it to the class with the largest known AoE in the game) when Kidney blow has is a melee skill. You're essentially saying "My turtle doesn't fly like my bird does so clearly Bird > Turtle". For a skill with 3k SA break, it's got a decent amount of AoE and is stupidly strong.

180k is actually higher than most HP values in this game, the only HP values higher are Guardian (A tank class) and Barbarian (186k, also tanky). So i don't know where you get the idea that 180k is low but if you ever ventured out of your little bubble of machina ignorance you'd realize that your class has more HP and Def than most. But no, by all means go play an archer and tell me how high their HP is, or play a sorc, or an academic, or a sin... You get the picture yet? Machina HP is one of the highest in the game and claiming otherwise is just blatant ignorance.

"Wallop has a long cooldown" okay so like, i know I mentioned that you never step out of your machina bubble but I've really got to do it again here. The counter CDs in the game are as follows:

- Crisis Howl (60 seconds)
- Counter Slash (40 seconds)
- Counter Exile (45 seconds)
- Cancel Circle Shot (45 seconds)
- Flaming Revenant (40 seconds)
- Avenging Wave (30 Seconds)
- Flash Grenade (22 seconds)
- Hypnosis (45 seconds)
- Quicks (45 seconds)
- Buzz Off (45 seconds)

(If you wanna hop on Shooting star or Priest and tell me about Utility then by all means~)

So, how does Wallop have a "long cooldown"? Maybe you should play a class beyond machina to understand how broken machina is. Air shove is good utility, It holds you in the air to defend against multiple attacks where as all other parry skills defend against one attack (except SoF which requires some expenditure to continue blocking) So, pray tell on how those skills are lacking in utility.
Also, yes Fly-by is great utility, regardless of its SA considering it be instantly cancelled into Beat down, Lariat, Flying Knee Kick etc etc. The amount of options you have from a single skill is obscene and quite frankly, stupid. And no, you can't chase fly-by with dash since it moves faster than dash and you can fly-by indefinitely.
Then you have Lariat, the be all and end all of initiations. Then you've got Gear Step and Duck (which reduces Gear Step CD by 90% meaning you'll have a long af AS boost as long as you know how to rotate your skills) to counter, combo and all around decimate people's SA.
THEN you have your Overclock, which is arguably the best heal in the game at 3% every second, meaning you'll get 100% HP after 33 seconds of healing. If you know how to space yourself properly then that's not very hard to achieve. In that time, Saint's great heal wouldn't even be off CD.


Your class is broken. Deal with it. You'd know that if you weren't a bad pvp-er or ignorant

I think you missed the point of balancing. Most classes has their own way to recover from mistakes. Having higher cooldown on recovery skills are compensated by the range/AOE/utilities certain classes have. But it is not complete on Ruina. If you think about a class from their whole mechanics, you'd be surprised how hard it is for her to bait and catch. It is true she has a strong Damage Transfer feature but without hitting, its just meaningless. (Remember she is a TRUE MELEE class). Free kill like a sitting duck.

Please do not refer to the outdated spreadsheet. It doesn't do justice. Kidney Blow suction doesn't break 3k SA break. Just build up SA and tumble out.

If Ruina is broken, she should've placed no.1 in ladder considering how OP she is.
OR.
There should be lots of bandwagon to this class.

[Kuru]

I think you missed the point of balancing. Most classes has their own way to recover from mistakes. Having higher cooldown on recovery skills are compensated by the range/AOE/utilities certain classes have. But it is not complete on Ruina. If you think about a class from their whole mechanics, you'd be surprised how hard it is for her to bait and catch. It is true she has a strong Damage Transfer feature but without hitting, its just meaningless. (Remember she is a TRUE MELEE class). Free kill like a sitting duck.

Please do not refer to the outdated spreadsheet. It doesn't do justice. Kidney Blow suction doesn't break 3k SA break. Just build up SA and tumble out.

If Ruina is broken, she should've placed no.1 in ladder considering how OP she is.
OR.
There should be lots of bandwagon to this class.

Well actually, Kidney blow does break over 3k, I've tested it myself multiple times but i'm more than happy to go over it again with you since you seem as thick as a concrete milkshake.

But you seem to lack the idea of what a "free kill" is, stomp -> Follow up/Follow through decimates SA leaving people wide open to receive a lariat right up their main street or a fly by (which does 15k in and of itself). Beat down is a safety skill which, by no means should even have the SA it has in the first place, You can heal 3% per second, You're one of the most mobile classes, You have one of the highest HP values, You have some of the highest damage, You have some of the highest SA break in the game.

If you want to understand what a free kill is, go play crusader or Physician, those classes are free kills. The fact that you blindly defend Ruina and ignore everyone point i made shows that you've got no real experience but you just want people to call your class balanced.

Also, using Ladder as a yardstick for a class' capability in comp on PvP shows how much you lack experience, and there would be nothing wrong with that if you were willing to learn. But let me continue to explain why that's disregarded in PvP. Ladder requires gear and Ruina falls short in PvE meaning gearing a Ruina will be harder than gearing a Light Fury or a Moonlord etc etc. Now, even at that point, let's say you're a fully geared Ruina. Most people will choose defensio because it's the stronger option, the class is still the same but they'll go for the easier selection. Ruina is by no means weak or bad because of this but it just means that defensio is stronger. Same as for the "bandwagon" point, people will choose the stronger option regardless of how strong the second option is, if the first choice is above it then they'll go with that.


And yes, i did think about Ruina from her "Whole mechanics" as you liked to put it. She has above average SA, High HP values, Extreme damage values, high SA break, multiple initiation skills and overall high mobility. If you think this class is bad then you're playing it wrong and if you're unwilling to accept that then there's nothing anyone can do to help you.

"Please do not refer to the outdated spreadsheet." well, i didn't know that facts had to do your class justice?? Those are the correct SA values but you seem to ignore them because they're not in favor of your point? What kind of justification is that??? The SA values within DN have not changed dramatically (i don't really think they changed at all for machina) since the spreadsheet was made, and that spreadsheet was made via extensive testing. The fact that you're writing it off because it "doesn't do justice" is so degrading to your entire argument. Instead of trying to counter any point i made (which you didn't by the way) you just tried to disregard it saying "But i find it hard"


You mention "Own way to recover from mistakes" which perfectly shows how people view PvP now, there should be no room to recover after you've made mistake upon mistake. The class caters to new players who don't know how to combo or how to counter but because it's so forgiving for the mistakes they make, the entire class becomes a joke.



tl;dr - You didn't actually respond to any point i made (which probably means i'm right, go figure), you just claimed that "it's meant to be like that". Come back when you have a basic understanding of how the class works or when you actually have some points to counter what I've said. Also google what a "free kill" is.

p.s. Here's a thought though, maybe it's not the class that's a free kill but rather... you are? Would your ign happen to be Mihie by any chance?

[En Jin (Engine)]

Well actually, Kidney blow does break over 3k, I've tested it myself multiple times but i'm more than happy to go over it again with you since you seem as thick as a concrete milkshake.

You tried to tank it? Who in their right mind wants to tank Kidney Blow? People would just emergengy evade or such considering casting time is kinda long.


But you seem to lack the idea of what a "free kill" is, stomp -> Follow up/Follow through decimates SA leaving people wide open to receive a lariat right up their main street or a fly by (which does 15k in and of itself). Beat down is a safety skill which, by no means should even have the SA it has in the first place, You can heal 3% per second, You're one of the most mobile classes, You have one of the highest HP values, You have some of the highest damage, You have some of the highest SA break in the game.

Again, you could just run away while Machina's casting animation or just AE + right click when she is using dmg transfer on normal attack. Not like she has range like Assassin's Chain thingy/ glad Front Shove/ ML Cyclone MBD/Flurry Spin Cut/etc.
Beat Down SA isn't high when combo-ed with AE/Knee Kick/Fly By. Circle break easily break SA. or front shove ex lift. or any explosions.
I didn't Overclock if my enemy doesn't play like a runner.
Not mobile enough like lancea erratic power + pushkick + headbutt.
Highest damage, I kinda Agree. SA breaker too.


If you want to understand what a free kill is, go play crusader or Physician, those classes are free kills. The fact that you blindly defend Ruina and ignore everyone point i made shows that you've got no real experience but you just want people to call your class balanced.

Good crusader are hard to be found these days. They could bait all AEs, escapes and kungfu people to death. Also they have airblock and autoblock increased chance so they could hold long enough to get back on their feet. Also have you ever get holy bolted? Zapped? Smited? Crusader is a bit like Ruina but with more advanced play. If Ruina need to combo until last punch to use Overheat, its the same for Crusader to combo until last hit of normal attack and Smite/relic/zap/etc.

I don't know about Physician. At least she have that poison pool and old lagma wave. Multiple slimes do annoys me though. She's easy to kill because of other classes dmg, range and aoe. So you can say Ruina = Physician without slime and lingering AOE skill.


Also, using Ladder as a yardstick for a class' capability in comp on PvP shows how much you lack experience, and there would be nothing wrong with that if you were willing to learn. But let me continue to explain why that's disregarded in PvP. Ladder requires gear and Ruina falls short in PvE meaning gearing a Ruina will be harder than gearing a Light Fury or a Moonlord etc etc. Now, even at that point, let's say you're a fully geared Ruina. Most people will choose defensio because it's the stronger option, the class is still the same but they'll go for the easier selection. Ruina is by no means weak or bad because of this but it just means that defensio is stronger. Same as for the "bandwagon" point, people will choose the stronger option regardless of how strong the second option is, if the first choice is above it then they'll go with that.

A is stronger than B which concludes B is weaker than A. Is it not? So if we were to list all the class comparisons.. Ruina would be in same tier with Phys, Saint and Crus. or lower maybe.
I used ladder as an example because it's strictly 1v1 and have faster update than the colosseum board which ranks people by pvp exp (which includes team pvp). Does this word chain makes your head dizzy?


And yes, i did think about Ruina from her "Whole mechanics" as you liked to put it. She has above average SA, High HP values, Extreme damage values, high SA break, multiple initiation skills and overall high mobility. If you think this class is bad then you're playing it wrong and if you're unwilling to accept that then there's nothing anyone can do to help you.

Oh. You forgot range. How far does the punch reach? Around 0.5meter in DN scale? This class isn't bad. Its just lagging behind with all the awakening. Extreme dmg values probably refering to defensio's taunting blow. Ruina didn't have that.

If you're saying high mobility is flyby>kneekick>beatdown, see how much skill have been used. Cooldown? expect her just to Flow Up on 0.5m range when enemy is like what.. emergency escape and already 5m away? You could literally see her coming with Lariat too. Can't you do anything about it? No skill to break SA? Circle Break i-frame Hello??


"Please do not refer to the outdated spreadsheet." well, i didn't know that facts had to do your class justice?? Those are the correct SA values but you seem to ignore them because they're not in favor of your point? What kind of justification is that??? The SA values within DN have not changed dramatically (i don't really think they changed at all for machina) since the spreadsheet was made, and that spreadsheet was made via extensive testing. The fact that you're writing it off because it "doesn't do justice" is so degrading to your entire argument. Instead of trying to counter any point i made (which you didn't by the way) you just tried to disregard it saying "But i find it hard"

No Comment on personal attacks. Removal of superarmor buffs like BTW and Guardian Force is when the SA values changed. There are no test done after the patch.


You mention "Own way to recover from mistakes" which perfectly shows how people view PvP now, there should be no room to recover after you've made mistake upon mistake. The class caters to new players who don't know how to combo or how to counter but because it's so forgiving for the mistakes they make, the entire class becomes a joke.

Then you wouldn't mind listing all class emergency blink/ emergency tumble/ recovery skill/ counter skill/ debuffs and why they have them. And then think about the damage the class deals.



tl;dr - You didn't actually respond to any point i made (which probably means i'm right, go figure), you just claimed that "it's meant to be like that". Come back when you have a basic understanding of how the class works or when you actually have some points to counter what I've said. Also google what a "free kill" is.

I did respond to most point you made. Probably if you digest my word with calm mind and serene heart you'd understand what I said.
You know the core concept of writing consist of main point, elaboration and examples? Yours have too much examples it became wall of text. I excluded examples to see how experienced you are with DN PVP and not just datamining from other sources.
Also, do you really need literal meaning? I am treating you as an adult so please understand.


p.s. Here's a thought though, maybe it's not the class that's a free kill but rather... you are? Would your ign happen to be Mihie by any chance?

Yes, I am Mihie. It maybe because of my piloting skill. And by the feeling of it, Ruina should get an escape skill. Have you seen other Ruina playing pvp? Have you ever tried it for around 100 matches?

[Kuru]

Yes, I am Mihie. It maybe because of my piloting skill. And by the feeling of it, Ruina should get an escape skill. Have you seen other Ruina playing pvp? Have you ever tried it for around 100 matches?

Ah so you're the person who claimed that you needed more SA when fighting my level 70, that explains everything.


And you clearly missed a lot of the points i made so let me reiterate them for you. (in no specific order)

BY THE WAY, I SAW YOU LIKED COLORS SO I INCLUDED A NICE BRIGHT YELLOW! HAVE FUN~



"A is stronger than B which concludes B is weaker than A. Is it not? So if we were to list all the class comparisons.. Ruina would be in same tier with Phys, Saint and Crus. or lower maybe.
I used ladder as an example because it's strictly 1v1 and have faster update than the colosseum board which ranks people by pvp exp (which includes team pvp). Does this word chain makes your head dizzy?"


The way i mentioned it was to give the example of why people chose Defensio over Ruina and why there are more defensios, the fact that you failed to understand that speaks volumes about what's to come already. No, Ruina is far beyond Saint, Crus and physi tier and the fact that you even considered that devalues your entire post to me because it shows how little you understand about other classes.



"Again, you could just run away while Machina's casting animation or just AE + right click when she is using dmg transfer on normal attack. Not like she has range like Assassin's Chain thingy/ glad Front Shove/ ML Cyclone MBD/Flurry Spin Cut/etc.
Beat Down SA isn't high when combo-ed with AE/Knee Kick/Fly By. Circle break easily break SA. or front shove ex lift. or any explosions.
I didn't Overclock if my enemy doesn't play like a runner.
Not mobile enough like lancea erratic power + pushkick + headbutt.
Highest damage, I kinda Agree. SA breaker too."


"Run away" is the key point there, you're suggesting that the only way to counter a machina is to kite them and play passively, which means that the class is stupid up close etc etc. Also, if you're eating ML's cyclone from a distance then it's 100% your fault and you deserve that punish. Every example you listed can be punished easily due to lack of SA, but machina's lariat has 600 SA and causes a knockback hitstate. The ability to punish lariat is a much steeper hill to climb than any of your aforementioned examples. "Circle break can easily break SA", do you know how circle break works? If you're eating a circle break on beat down then you're doing something wrong because it's got essentially 0 SA and no vertical hitbox so i don't know what you're doing wrong. "I didn't overclock if my enemy doesn't play like a runner" That still doesn't remove the fact that your class has the highest heal in the game. It doesn't matter if you use it but rather it is there. "Not mobile enough" alright imma cut in right there, you're using fly by wrong if you're slower than a lencea... that's it.




"You tried to tank it? Who in their right mind wants to tank Kidney Blow? People would just emergengy evade or such considering casting time is kinda long."


Actually i was just refuting your point about the SAb of kidney blow but apparently you forgot about that... funny huh.



"Good crusader are hard to be found these days. They could bait all AEs, escapes and kungfu people to death. Also they have airblock and autoblock increased chance so they could hold long enough to get back on their feet. Also have you ever get holy bolted? Zapped? Smited? Crusader is a bit like Ruina but with more advanced play. If Ruina need to combo until last punch to use Overheat, its the same for Crusader to combo until last hit of normal attack and Smite/relic/zap/etc.

I don't know about Physician. At least she have that poison pool and old lagma wave. Multiple slimes do annoys me though. She's easy to kill because of other classes dmg, range and aoe. So you can say Ruina = Physician without slime and lingering AOE skill."


Alright so big difference right outta the gate is that Crusader requires skill, ruina doesn't. Ruina is a simple button mash class while physician and sader actually require a thought before attacking. And Ruinas don't need to combo, their pure damage output is enough to live by without actually combo'ing (except the damage transfer left clicks if you even want to count that as a combo). And no, Ruina is far far FAR beyond physician tier.




Oh. You forgot range. How far does the punch reach? Around 0.5meter in DN scale? This class isn't bad. Its just lagging behind with all the awakening. Extreme dmg values probably refering to defensio's taunting blow. Ruina didn't have that.

If you're saying high mobility is flyby>kneekick>beatdown, see how much skill have been used. Cooldown? expect her just to Flow Up on 0.5m range when enemy is like what.. emergency escape and already 5m away? You could literally see her coming with Lariat too. Can't you do anything about it? No skill to break SA? Circle Break i-frame Hello??


You've never actually played warrior have you? Circle break iFrame lasts for 0.3 seconds, that's only the initial jump. The rest of the skill (including the swing down) isn't an iFrame and if you're being punished by circle break in lariat, you're bad in a way i didn't even know was possible. And i was talking about Ruina's damage values, her 50 will lead to damage transfer landing 10k -> 17k -> 17k, I've done it to people...

And no, i said high mobility is the use of Fly by, your high utility comes from your ability to CHAIN Fly by into beatdown or lariat or knee kick etc etc. It's the ABILITY to chain those at the drop of a hat which gives Ruina its utility. That and one of the shortest CD counter skills in the game (Speaking of which, you seemingly omitted that huh? Why didn't you bring that up anymore since it was such a big point in your previous post)




Then you wouldn't mind listing all class emergency blink/ emergency tumble/ recovery skill/ counter skill/ debuffs and why they have them. And then think about the damage the class deals.


Yet i can promise you that Ruina will probably still come out somewhere near the top but asking me to list every aspect of every class just to satisfy your urge to try to be right is astounding. Here's a thought, experience them!




No Comment on personal attacks. Removal of superarmor buffs like BTW and Guardian Force is when the SA values changed. There are no test done after the patch.


But the base super armor values that were mentioned in it is still correct is my point. Disregarding the lack of SA from the buff, the BASE values are the same. And don't ignore the rest of it, it was making a show of how you try to ignore something because it doesn't fit in with your narrative. Because the SA spreadsheet doesn't fit in with your story of "Ruina is weak" you ignore its existence. You're quite literally closing your ears to anything except what you WANT to hear.



I did respond to most point you made. Probably if you digest my word with calm mind and serene heart you'd understand what I said.
You know the core concept of writing consist of main point, elaboration and examples? Yours have too much examples it became wall of text. I excluded examples to see how experienced you are with DN PVP and not just datamining from other sources.
Also, do you really need literal meaning? I am treating you as an adult so please understand.



But you see, the problem is you that you didn't reply to most of my points. You completely bypassed the mention of your "long CD" on wallop, you ignored what i said about HP values, you didn't even mention Overclock heals... You pretty much cherry picked the parts you thought you could respond to without seeming like an idiot but that backfired anyway. And I hope I've shown you my experience with DN PvP because I'm under the assumption that you didn't include examples because you couldn't think of any

Sorry, i'm trying to treat you as an adult but it's just so hard to not talk down to your level at this point.




Yes, I am Mihie. It maybe because of my piloting skill. And by the feeling of it, Ruina should get an escape skill. Have you seen other Ruina playing pvp? Have you ever tried it for around 100 matches?



"100 matches" isn't enough to get experience in this game, and it rings true with how you're posting. People don't really get average until about the 500th win mark alone. And as i stated before, people don't pick Ruina because defensio is simply stronger and people just want to win. Ruina will still get the win most of the time but Defensio has more utility. And i knew it was you because you spouted the same BS "We need more SA" when you were losing to me actually in-game a few days back.



Now, I'm not going to say this as an asshole but I mean this seriously. Get more experience in PvP before you start trying to post as if you know everything. It just comes across as you blindly asking for your class to be buffed yet Ruina doesn't really struggle against most classes. I've watched as NurseYuki decimates opponent after opponent with her Ruina, it's possible. Instead you're spreading misinformation simply because you lack the ability to use the class properly. I suggest thoroughly learning your class and how other classes play before you try to make comparisons like you did, i.e. "Ruina = Physi" or how it's "the same tier as Saint, crusader or physi". These comparisons are frankly insulting to any players of those classes.

So I say this seriously. Learn your class, learn the game mechanics and learn each other class in the game before you start talking about balance. Spreading misinformation is more damaging than anything else.

[En Jin (Engine)]

*sniped*

Which one are you again? Maelstrom spamming destroyer? How many times did my Overheat actually hit you? Just because you dont know how to bait AE/escapes doesn't mean Ruina is stupid up close.

All of the utility that made Machina strong is in Defensio tree. If you ever played Ruina for like 500 wins (if you could), you'll understand the struggle. Create 1v1 room and don't ever ban any class that enter your room. Fight them and record the match.

I would record and upload it if I have a good pc but I'm using a toaster. My fault again huh? Its okay.

I'm Done.

[Aimele]

Lets be cool, as a fellow Ruina user.
I have play all female classes in DN, and from my experience, Ruina is the hardest class to master. Her skills are hard to connect and sometimes bug. Ruina is pure melee class with nearly no range skill at all. SA while casting skill not so high, can be easily break though (kidney blow & beat down), but she is a class that specialize in melee, so another melee class might have some difficulty fighting Ruina. But again, its all about how good you control your character.
But, well I'll just try my best to figure out how to fight any classes out there. Ruina still has some upgrade to do.. Dont forget the awakened skill still waiting out there somewhere.

I love Ruina <3

[Kuru]

Which one are you again? Maelstrom spamming destroyer? How many times did my Overheat actually hit you? Just because you dont know how to bait AE/escapes doesn't mean Ruina is stupid up close.

All of the utility that made Machina strong is in Defensio tree. If you ever played Ruina for like 500 wins (if you could), you'll understand the struggle. Create 1v1 room and don't ever ban any class that enter your room. Fight them and record the match.

I would record and upload it if I have a good pc but I'm using a toaster. My fault again huh? Its okay.

I'm Done.

Actually, i can't spam maelstrom on a level 70, so there's the first problem. And You can win 500 times on any class, i've done it with barbarian this cap when barbarian is food for most people. But since you refuse to listen even when i explain it to you let me put it this way.

You're bad, you're quite literally destined to be bad forever because your head is so far up your own ass you'll be giving yourself a colonoscopy before too long. You refuse to listen to serious advice and just block it off saying "You don't understand machina" when machina is such a joke of a class, the fact that you're failing it is even more hilarious. Also, Ruina is stupid up close yet i still beat your ass 3-0... doesn't that just make you bad? Don't blame YOUR shortcomings on your class, it's unsightly.

You've had your fun now you can go back to the kiddy corner, the adults will go back to what this thread was originally discussing. And that was ways to make PvP better, not "Autismos first PvP match" like you wanted to make it about.

[Kuru]

Why are you still here? Also trying to take the "better person" road doesn't work when you tell someone to kill themselves.

But the fact that i've got you to the point where you're actually telling me to kill myself over a video game is amazing in and of itself, so thank you for making me laugh like that.


But, talk about hate, infront of everyone you're advocating suicide because you dislike someone? Typical childish rage. Maybe if you spent more time practicing and instead of trying to come up with words to fail you wouldn't have this problem? You're not worth anymore of my time though to be completely honest.


If you can't handle the truth that you're shit then you're not cut out to be on the internet. If someone disagreeing with you pushes you to the point of wishing death upon them, then i dare say you're unstable. I hope you look back on this and realize what you're typing over a video game. bb, you're not worth any of my responses anymore~

[Verbena]

That's enough. No need to resort to telling people to kill themselves over PvP.

If this keeps going I will have to lock the thread.

[En Jin (Engine)]

(Obligatory 10 letters to post)

xD

[Kuru]

There are some cosmetic things I'd like in PvP which shouldn't be too hard:

- The ability to choose the colours for the two teams instead of just "red and blue", allow people to choose "White and black" or something else.

- Different Variations on the currently released maps - What I mean by this is changing the environment file for Lost temple to use one of the night time environments, giving us "Night time Lost Temple". Or Changing the hue on the walls and the environment file to give us an Autumn variation of the map. These changes would be simple to do but give us more options aesthetically when PvPing.

- Releasing Skill effect changers as a PvP reward. (And making them properly noticeable)

- Release the White/Red PvP Costume variations that was found when people went Data mining.

[pancimania]

about all the cosmetic change, i support only point 2. different environtment is great idea. the rest i was not quite sure, but of course require lots of coding (about point 1, unless there was more than 2 team, adding extra color may be a good idea)

(rather than writing extra post, i guess i write my wishlist here)
-i prefer weapon costume, that use old skin (troll sword,elf queen,manti,apo,barnac,sea dragon, etc) to become durational costume that can be exchanged with colosseum medal. it was expensive, but not require high pvp lvl. also some skill plate that can be traded with medal (like in dwc), i think it was nice.

-my other wishlist is simple, incerase HP, reduce all skill dmg,and extremely incerase basic mouse left click hit damage. so to kill enemy in pvp at last 3 recatch is required.

-last wishlist it make pvp medal viable option, like buying exclusive gear for pve, so it was worth for people doing pvp in this salty community (i personally dislike horn of life pvp lvl requirement to buy it, it was too high, better reduce lvl requirement and make it more expensive)

[mrpotatom]

sorc rapes i can take, I wont tilt. But FCKING BOOBS RUNNING AROUND WITH SHARP FANS BLOWING PAINFUL WIND UP YOUR ASS AND FCKING ROLLING AROUND THE PLACE CANCELING YOUR SKILLS WQPOEPWQOEPWQEOQPWEOWQPEOWQPEOQWPEOQ
AND THEN GUESS WHAT, RAY MECHA ADDS UP WITH THEIR INSANE WTF DAMAGE OF THAT ANNOYING MOONLORD LIKE SKILL. ANOTHA ONE! AND THERE'S THE GOOD OL' MACHINA WITH THEIR ANNOYING VOICES AND THOSE "WER MA HP GONE HOLEE SHT" "HEAD BUTT HURT LIKE SHT TO THE HEROES OF LAGENDIA. NANI?!" ALSO ALSO, THEY ALMOST FCKED UP THE ORACLE ELDER PVP SIDE, I THOUGHT THEY WONT CHANGE IT, CUZ FCK ME, PRE-NERF, SHE HURTS AS FCK AND THE AOE. GLAD THEY CHANGED THAT FAST. BUT THEN YOU KNOW WHAT ITCHES ME THE MOST? IT'S THE FACT THAT THOSE FLYING BIRDS SHITTING TRAPS ALL OVER THE PLACE AND HUGE FCKING AOE SKILLS ARCHER KINDA LOOKING FAIRIES + THOSE FCKING HANDS SPAMMING BOOBS LIKE WTF? IS THIS RE;ZERO SHT?

edit:
oh yea my wish, pls give us more auto open pandora box and a balance pvp gameply.