Forum moderators...

[aaron]

Mfw people put so much emphasize on the forums. Hope you know it's widely understood that only a small percentage of users actually use the forums. Forums in the grand scheme of things are also very low priority.

ED needs better spam filters for the time being.

[Seimore]

Mfw people put so much emphasize on the forums. Hope you know it's widely understood that only a small percentage of users actually use the forums. Forums in the grand scheme of things are also very low priority.

ED needs better spam filters for the time being.

While a very small percentage may actively use the forums, I'd say a fair deal of new players check the forums before playing a game.

Personally, I always check a forum before playing a game, if it's dead, the game probably is too. I've yet to see a lively game with an inactive official forum. If someone else were to do that, I doubt they'd stick around if they see that the company can't even keep volunteer mods around to get rid of spam/ bots.

Picking respectable members of the community to just weed out these kinds of posts is a fine thing. I get that abuse can happen, but that can either be avoided by choosing carefully or it can be reprimanded immediately. It's direly needed.

[Tiyara]

Yeah if illbeURdeath becomes forum mods, first thing he's going to do is ban CrazyzZeuS

[aaron]

While a very small percentage may actively use the forums, I'd say a fair deal of new players check the forums before playing a game.

Personally, I always check a forum before playing a game, if it's dead, the game probably is too. I've yet to see a lively game with an inactive official forum. If someone else were to do that, I doubt they'd stick around if they see that the company can't even keep volunteer mods around to get rid of spam/ bots.

Picking respectable members of the community to just weed out these kinds of posts is a fine thing. I get that abuse can happen, but that can either be avoided by choosing carefully or it can be reprimanded immediately. It's direly needed.

My point is that he puts way too much emphasize on the forums as an integral part of the game (ie when he says he won't pay money until they hire forum mods, basically his title). It's not. It's a very small part of the game. As a not so veteran player, I check the forums very often, but the sections that new players need to go to are not affected. Not only that, forum moderators are not the root fix in this issue. Better spam filters are, as I mentioned previously. My post was more or less a reality check. Get down to earth and adjust your expectations accordingly.

I'm all for forum moderators, but not as our first line of defense and our only solution... and definitely not someone form the community. That's just inefficient.

Edit:

I get that abuse can happen, but that can either be avoided by choosing carefully or it can be reprimanded immediately. It's direly needed.

I want to address this part specifically. Given Eyedentity's track history in the past month of hosting this game, what makes you think they can enforce punishment on mod abuse in a respectable amount of time? Your offered solutions to combat moderator abuse is not acceptable and honestly not believable. They barely look outside of bug reports with Yaya being the only staff member that actively posts on the forums. There's substantial proof that the forums and even communication is put on a lesser priority.

I get people spamming for forum mods, but if anything it's a temporary band-aid that may cause an infection later on.

[Seimore]

My point is that he puts way too much emphasize on the forums as an integral part of the game (ie when he says he won't pay money until they hire forum mods, basically his title). It's not. It's a very small part of the game. As a not so veteran player, I check the forums very often, but the sections that new players need to go to are not affected. Not only that, forum moderators are not the root fix in this issue. Better spam filters are, as I mentioned previously. My post was more or less a reality check. Get down to earth and adjust your expectations accordingly.

I'm all for forum moderators, but not as our first line of defense and our only solution... and definitely not someone form the community. That's just inefficient.

Edit:


I want to address this part specifically. Given Eyedentity's track history in the past month of hosting this game, what makes you think they can enforce punishment on mod abuse in a respectable amount of time? Your offered solutions to combat moderator abuse is not acceptable and honestly not believable. They barely look outside of bug reports with Yaya being the only staff member that actively posts on the forums. There's substantial proof that the forums and even communication is put on a lesser priority.

I get people spamming for forum mods, but if anything it's a temporary band-aid that may cause an infection later on.

The thing is though, it'll never be "optimal" or "efficient" to have people moderate each other, simply because we're people. But having an automated system in place tends to miff off actual customers more than bots.

You can't just say "Because it may not work we can't do it" If we did that, nothing would ever get done. As long as a human is in the equation, uncertainty will always be a thing. That is just something we'll need to deal with when we try to better our community as a whole.

You either take the risk and be prepared to deal with things if they go wrong, or let it fester. That's how any sort of moderation goes, and that is why you need to pick carefully.

[aaron]

The thing is though, it'll never be "optimal" or "efficient" to have people moderate each other, simply because we're people. But having an automated system in place tends to miff off actual customers more than bots.

You can't just say "Because it may not work we can't do it" If we did that, nothing would ever get done. As long as a human is in the equation, uncertainty will always be a thing. That is just something we'll need to deal with when we try to better our community as a whole.

You either take the risk and be prepared to deal with things if they go wrong, or let it fester. That's how any sort of moderation goes, and that is why you need to pick carefully.

You're running off a tangent at this point and kind of putting words in my mouth at this point.

Let me clarify:
1. I think forum moderators from the community will be not "optimal" or "efficient". Forum moderators from unbiased and outside sources will be better to deal with the current forum anarchy.
2. Spam filters and bot combat are automated systems in tons of forums and websites. Contrary to what your post implies, spam filters only filter spam (ie. bot spam posts), not moderate the forum as a whole.
3. If you want to talk about "actual customers", it's better to deal with the in game issues rather than the forums. Arguing in favor of the forums would be shooting ED in the foot. We do not want to cripple our already crippled developers AND publishers.
4. I have asked several times what makes you think ED is capable of enforcing punishment on moderators, or what makes them even prepared in the first place. Shoving the notion that we should jump the gun down my throat is not the answer.

[Seimore]

No need to really quote since you're right above me so '^'/

Apologies, didn't mean to offend.

I just feel inaction is worse than gambling on an action. Anything is better than the forum being flooded with spam.

Kinda replying in between work stuff so I may be a smidge disheveled

[aaron]

No worries. I see a lot of aggressive wording in my posts, so my apologies. I think I started forum warrioring again lol. Anyways, I see your point though.

I see the need for outside the community forum moderators, but I'll just leave it at that.

[Amaurus]

Just a moderator that culls the spam would be more than sufficient. If they do anything other that than just strip their privileges, easy as that.

[Source]

bumpppppppp

[aaron]

nevermind...

[SachiMizora]

Lmao, when I saw the spam yesterday (for my time)
I was just like "brb I'll be in other game forums"
This happens quite a bit on other forums I've seen but they've had player mods to moderate when the GMs themselves couldn't/were asleep.
I do suggest hiring player mods for no payment at all if they won't be adding an extra layer of security for forums or w.e, of course this should be done carefully as some players cannot be trusted/won't be doing their job.

[aaron]

Lmao, when I saw the spam yesterday (for my time)
I was just like "brb I'll be in other game forums"
This happens quite a bit on other forums I've seen but they've had player mods to moderate when the GMs themselves couldn't/were asleep.
I do suggest hiring player mods for no payment at all if they won't be adding an extra layer of security for forums or w.e, of course this should be done carefully as some players cannot be trusted/won't be doing their job.

Given ED's lack of communication and lack of English fluent staff, what makes you think this is possible?

[SachiMizora]

... they can just check the forums + their ingame accounts to see if its safe?
How do you think nexon choose their player mods?
How do you think any gaming forum chooses their mods?
Just do the same thing they do.
And even if they don't choose a player to moderate the forums, I already suggested adding an extra layer of security if they don't want to bother with player mods.
All they have to do is do one or the other or the bots will come back & make the forums unreadable until they themselves can delete it which already takes time.

[''']

you missed the part that said "ED's lack of communication and lack of English fluent staff"

[aaron]

1. What's the guidelines of "safe"?
2. Nexon had employees that purely focused on the community and were fluent in English. Nexon North America, at its core was also a PUBLISHING company, with emphasize to communicate and localize for their market. Eyedentity DOES NOT have ANY of that. What makes you think that ED has the same conditions as Nexon? Our publisher also develops the game and they're more focused on development than publishing. Not to mention our publisher (and developer) have shown time and time again they have little to no fluency in the English language.
3. By not doing so. What makes you think they can read through the application process that other online game forums go through when they can't even properly proof read their teaser posters and half the events and items released in the game?
4. What is "the same thing"? They can't do the same thing because they don't understand English?

In terms of extra layer of security like spam filters, captchas, and things of that nature, I completely agree.

[gvue]

You can't add new content into an existing game that has a fundamental breakdown. Simple, don't add new shit until you fix the core problems.

[Elune]

You can't add new content into an existing game that has a fundamental breakdown. Simple, don't add new shit until you fix the core problems.

What does that have anything to do with the topic at hand?

I'd rather them avoid the volunteer mods who play the game on this server. Not trying to say anyone's untrustworthy, but a lot of our players (heck me included) are just not capable of moderating with a unbiased mindset.