The Problem of PVP

[ErickEych]

HI ED, PLEASE LOOK UNTO THESE AND DO IT AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE. I LOVE THIS GAME THATS WHY IM WRITING THESE.

As time goes by, and up to this date, the game is still continuing to increase its variables and skills are continuously getting changed. The main problem is every update, or balancing not all are getting adjusted and its takes TOO MUCH time before they do changes. And most of it are broken, just to be in favor of PVE.

Skills that have changed that became OP because of PVE that break the game (in PVP POV).

[General]
> Awakening, like yeah. I'm happy their doing changes and such, doing balancing and stuff even with awakening, but the passive enhancements that really benefit classes that really dominate other classes portray a huge part in the game. THE THING IS, NOT ALL ENHANCEMENTS ARE TREATED THE SAME WAY. To elaborate further, some just got Cooldown time saves, while others got Cooldown time saves and at the same time, an enhancement to the skill itself, which makes it so imbalanced and unfair to other variables. [TLDR: (Optional) I recommend to disable all the passives and actives and let the PVE people enjoy the future contents of the skills that we never wanted.]
> Buff changes, well it made it more chaotic now the developers adding group buff at the same time with awakening. =)) RIP GPVP. Spam it to win it, makes literally buff other character's damage and combos that shouldn't connect that can be made with global speed buff.

[Force User]
> Force Mirror : The ticks are crazy with huge AOE and crazy SAB for a tick, it can cancel some skills that can even beat the EX version (Smasher's Mirror). [TLDR: I'm not saying to buff Smasher's mirror, nerf this crazy change that wasn't meant to work that it used to be.]
> Force Shield : The change of having a Super Armor buff makes it broken. The skills that were meant to be cancelled, didn't happen and can even use certain skills to tank other skills which makes it more crazy.

[Majesty]
> [Awakened] Teleport : Why you didn't listen to the proposed paper, and made it more crazy? Why? Why buff it? Why it can be used anytime with casting other skills? Why increased AOE? Disappointed. Reduce SAB for atleast.

[Saleana]
> Rolling Lava EX : Explosion to be activated immediately? Please make skills can be dodge-able by a human reaction time.

[Black Mara]
> Entomb : Increase CD and decrease duration of resonator. Why? Coz it's a crazy SAB dealer that tracks u till the very last breathe of your life, and it deals alot of damage partner up with [Ripping] + [Enhanced Contract].

-

[Gladiator]
> [Awakened] Parry : Reduced SAB and reduced damage, it's enough to be an evasion skill, and it's too much to be an SA killer regardless of how high is its value, just like what you did to Adept's Magma Jump, that you really did well on changing it.
> [Awake Skill] Hyper Drive : Reduce SAB, so it can be SA tanked.

[Moonlord]
> [Awakened] Eclipse : Best evasion skill / SAB breaker that ever existed in the game. Increase CD or REDUCE SAB or BOTH.
> Crescent Cleave EX : Remove the ability to change its position by pressing the [Backward Key Button]. (This can literally wipe 50-70% depending on what class you use).
> Moon Blade Dance EX : Remove CD reduction. (Imagine 6s)? LOL.

[Dark Avenger]
> Avenger Force : Increase CD.
> Dark Avenger : Increase CD
> Dark Riser : Reduce SA. (It literally beats Mercenary's Flying Swing in terms of SA)

-

[Kali]
> Dummy Ghost : Remove the ability to be used during knockdown. Kali s are naturally mobile, stop buffing and adding more evades. She doesn't need this.

[Dark Summoner]
> Chain Claw EX : Remove the ability to be used as an instant during aerial usage with [Space Bar or Jump Button]. So it can be dodge-able by a human reaction time.

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[Sniper]
> [Awakened] Siege Stance : Fix a bug where it doesn't deplete its cooldown after the skill to be used.

[Artillery]
> Scope Arrow EX : Remove the ability to explode immediately by [Normal Attack Button] or left click. So it can be dodge-able by a human reaction time.
> [Awake Skill] Cyclone Harpoon : Increase CD to 60s. [or disable awakening]
> [Awake Skill] Cannonade : Remove the ability to be enhanced by [Fatal Tracking] bubbles, it can no longer be enhanced. So it can be dodge-able by a human reaction time.
> [Fatal] Tracking Arrows : Reduce SAB and make it dodge-able (reduce active frames).

[Hunter]
> Arrow Storm : Damage reduce for [Tracking].
> Summon Falcon : Increase CD from 60s to 90s.

[Silver Hunter]
> Silver Hunter : Increase CD from 120s to 150s.
> Moment Evasion : Increase CD from 15s to 20s.

-

[Adept]
> Magma Punch EX : Remove the ability to change its position using [Forward Button Key] or [Backward Button Key].
> Magma Wall EX : Remove the ability to change its position using [Forward Button Key] or [Backward Button Key].

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[Piercer]
> Spinning Swing : Increase CD.

[Flurry]
> Spinning Skewer : Increase CD.

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Please do it, ED. Copy all those and IMPLEMENT IT.

[oper1]

Hi, we'll be releasing the patch note for the PVP update. Please look forward to it -- EYEDENTITY Games

[ErickEych]

Bro, I'm aware of those patch notes, and those weren't enough. And some are left untouched. I'm always updated to their patch notes up to date. This is for their future balancing, that some are left broken.

[NearLawlet]

He was being sarcastic about how ED would never respond to your post since they care little for their players' opinion.

[ErickEych]

So, they really dont care about player's feedback?

[NearLawlet]

Petition to change EyeGacha event from account-based to character-based to increase sale > ignored.

Numerous forum reports concerning in-game bugs > ignored.

Dozens of suggestion to improve game overall balance > ignored.

If those aren't enough hints, then I don't know what is.

[NearLawlet]

Balancing PVP is much, much harder than balancing PVE.

In the latter case, there aren't many controlled variables and one can outfit each character with similar type of equipment (e.g Skilla Set +10) then gauge their estimated potential by their performance in the latest, most challenging content (Black Dragon Time Attack). Naturally, there's no tangible way to ensure similar level of piloting in this test, but other controlled variables (enemy attack, gear score) can be easily adjusted for fair evaluation.

In the former case, however, there's a whole new set of variables to be factored in the equation; including but not limited to: Super Armor (SAB), Super Armor Break (SAB), Hit Status (knockdown, lift, paralyze etc) and Debuff Status (Freeze, Frostbite, Slow, Electrocution, Time Stop, etc). These variables have no effect whatsoever on raid bosses, so they can be safely ignored in PVE evaluation. On the other hand, they are essential factors in PVP so they can't be dismissed just as easily.

Plus, you have to consider the perspective of each and every class in PVP in order achieve firm grasp on their advantages and disadvantages (e.g I hate it when Crusaders spam their instant awakening, but I can somewhat understand the necessity given how low their damage is. Heck, because of their hybrid stats, Crusader's Smite EX is actually even weaker than Guardian's Smite.)

Besides, PVP content does not yield much profit for EyeDentity (It's nowhere near as popular as Fortnite, League of Legends, Dota2) so I highly doubt they will make some adjustment anytime soon.

TL;DR We passengers can try and patch all the holes we could find, but this ship is going to sink nonetheless.

[ErickEych]

Putting p2w stuff would definitely kill the game more, trust me. LOL. You know that the golden age of DN was all about fun PVE is not that hard, and PVP is skill based back then. The reason why there a lot of people playing this game to thousands, coz cash items are less likely to do more and just for cosmetics..

[Xenocho]

All this talk of killing the game yet the game survives..

[ryanbayani238@gmail.com]

They could've boost crusaders damage as a compensation from lowering the rate of ins :< seriously, Holy relic's damage is crap, Judgment hammer melee damage is okay but when used for long range, deals 300 per hit... also Guardian smite is stronger than Crus smite like wtf?!? I didnt even kill sh's bird. I used relic, JH, and smite and that shiet still alive..

[jeecay]

xD pvp discussions are so unusual and trivial nowadays,, even in DNSea discord...
which really tells you a lot


as much as how frustrating how unbalanced you claim dn pvp is, this list can't be just it..
you're still missing a lot of broken skills.. that's why implementing those you listed won't make a balanced pvp because one way or another, another class would rule in terms of this and that and so on.. you cannot disable skills just because it feels "unbalanced".. part of why i love dn pvp is the number of skills i get to use,, so losing a few will be a punch in the gut for me.. so don't go claiming all pvp players don't want awakening skills..

here's my suggestion, on top of longer cd, add a bubble system to all awakenings and possibly class mastery 2 & 3 ..(although, we are literally reaching for the stars here if we think our suggestions can even reach ED's monitor so..)

also,, i really don't think that being unbalanced is the problem of dn pvp nowadays.. it's the terrible players..
nothing makes my game experience exponentially worse than players abusing warping their skills or snipers with their unlimited siege stance bug or players with oversized ego who keep trash talking on you for fighting back..xDD and what happened to the simple etiquette of sitting when you're 8 people going against 1 in gpvp??

if these are the types of passengers i'm with.. i won't even bother trying to save the boat.. let us drown FFS.. bye

[ErickEych]

Balancing PVP is much, much harder than balancing PVE.
Plus, you have to consider the perspective of each and every class in PVP in order achieve firm grasp on their advantages and disadvantages (e.g I hate it when Crusaders spam their instant awakening, but I can somewhat understand the necessity given how low their damage is. Heck, because of their hybrid stats, Crusader's Smite EX is actually even weaker than Guardian's Smite.)

Besides, PVP content does not yield much profit for EyeDentity (It's nowhere near as popular as Fortnite, League of Legends, Dota2) so I highly doubt they will make some adjustment anytime soon.

TL;DR We passengers can try and patch all the holes we could find, but this ship is going to sink nonetheless.

On the upcoming PVP patch next update, which they really made a really good job on working on it. Trust me, it's all on the POV fighting against with. And the class you mention Crusader? Will also get into the nerf hammer, and even if crusader got low damage, its not good to give him that spammable skill to compensate just to boost its SAB CC. Anyhow, it'll be good next update more or less, no need it to be discussed further.

You know why the game isn't popular anymore, or specifically the MMORPG genre? Because the game caters to casuals that requires most of it to NO SKILL, the games you mentioned are skill-based and cosmetics are OPTIONAL, WHICH SHOULD BE DONE IN EVERY GAME, and eventually people would support the game if they find the game well made and decent that requires real skill. Hence, people are playing it up to date.

[NearLawlet]

Like I said, there are many factors to consider in PVP.

I hate those cheap instant awakening skills as much as the next person, but Crusaders are plenty weak enough as it is with only one evasion skill and low overall damage, so I believe that much is justifiable.

Why don't you try fighting a Defensio? You will find that Crusader (and really, any other class in your list) is adorable compared to the vastly overpowered feline.

[ErickEych]

I know that Defensio is way better than crus in terms of 1v1. Don't speak too soon after u see next patch.

[NearLawlet]

Thank you kindly for the advice, but I'm well aware of all the future changes from DN KR. The fact that I only translated PVE skill balancing for this forum does not mean I'm lacking information on PVP changes; it was simply because that's the only thing people care about nowadays.

I've said my piece. I doubt your suggestion will ever reach ED, and I certainly won't hold my breath, but nevertheless I bid you good luck.

[ErickEych]

xD pvp discussions are so unusual and trivial nowadays,, even in DNSea discord...
which really tells you a lot


as much as how frustrating how unbalanced you claim dn pvp is, this list can't be just it..
you're still missing a lot of broken skills.. that's why implementing those you listed won't make a balanced pvp because one way or another, another class would rule in terms of this and that and so on.. you cannot disable skills just because it feels "unbalanced".. part of why i love dn pvp is the number of skills i get to use,, so losing a few will be a punch in the gut for me.. so don't go claiming all pvp players don't want awakening skills..

here's my suggestion, on top of longer cd, add a bubble system to all awakenings and possibly class mastery 2 & 3 ..(although, we are literally reaching for the stars here if we think our suggestions can even reach ED's monitor so..)

also,, i really don't think that being unbalanced is the problem of dn pvp nowadays.. it's the terrible players..
nothing makes my game experience exponentially worse than players abusing warping their skills or snipers with their unlimited siege stance bug or players with oversized ego who keep trash talking on you for fighting back..xDD and what happened to the simple etiquette of sitting when you're 8 people going against 1 in gpvp??

if these are the types of passengers i'm with.. i won't even bother trying to save the boat.. let us drown FFS.. bye

Yes, it may seem to be not enough, but most of it would lessen the gap of imbalance if these were to implemented.

Bubble system on awakening you say? You should know not all of it works the same way. You get bubbles through 1: Hitting an enemy accurately 2: Accumulate overtime every second 3: Gaining it by casting skills. AND NO, That's not good, CD is the best way to do it without giving it more complex.

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If anything else, if they really don't care about the player's feedback, then this game don't deserve to be popular and retain what is it in right now.

[EnmeiKouki]

as what others noted, devs don't read the forums or any staff that will inform dev team for such requests

i would like to add some opinions though with regards to PvP changes;

- remove fast hit lock of Poison Missile from Sorceress
- remove pull effect of Cyclone Slash EX from Moonlord
- reduce area of Cyclone Harpoon from Artillery
- reduce area of Black Mara transform (when holding backwards)
- reduce active frames of Arrow Storm and Tracking Arrow (repeating it again)
- Tempest Kick Shot EX; increase distance + animation speed + SA
- bring back old Guillotine Cross of Raven
- change Unseen Art of Light Fury, make it like Consecration of Inquisitor
- add alot of pvp music tracks and put it on random, delete the current one
- update DWC and sync it with main server's available classes

[ErickEych]

- Tempest Kick Shot EX; increase distance + animation speed + SA

No. What are you trying to do? Triple Slash Awk v2? Meme.

[Lacheruu]

Nah Fam. From my warrior perspective

Gladiator is already been nerfed to death lol
Swordmaster class line don't have Paralyze-Escape or Paralyze-Counter passive skills and you want their only counter skill to be nerfed lol.
as for Hyper Drive no it doesn't need nerfing that skill is already Locked at 20 Max Bubbles with Low Damage (3k per hit lol) and Gladiator Bubble is hard to gain because it needs effort and it has cooldown lmaoo


I would agree with you on Moonlord and Dark Avenger those 2 needs hard nerfing
Eclipse iFrame should change to SA it's retardedly op. Literally cancels everything and then they throw you the tornado and game over for you.
Crescent Cleave just reduce the damage lol. Moon Blade Dance doesn't need Nerfing thou.

Yes. Avenger Force(30s) needs higher cooldown and put a condition of needing for it to hit to gain the bubble like Gladiators Brave(35s)
and Remove the COOLDOWN PLATE because that shiii can be CD plate.

Dark Riser SA should be on Flying Swing. Dark Riser SA is high af.

and Put a cooldown on Recover (DA's Mini Iron Skin) this skill doesn't have a cooldown. Like SA doesn't matter in PvP wtf ED

The only problem with DA and Moonlord is how easy for them to get Bubbles and use their Ace Skills.
MBD is Spammable because Moonlord just need to spam MLS or any ML tree skills to gain bubbles. atleast they should put a condition of "Hit-Gain" same goes for Avenger Force

While the other warrior class have condition on their bubbles.

Make these 2 gay class fight like a man


I hope they boost SA of Destroyers because their awakening skills can be easily cancelled like wtf. If DA's Dark Riser have Action Speed Plate. Destroyers should have too for their flying swing.

[ErickEych]

Nah Fam. From my warrior perspective

Gladiator is already been nerfed to death lol
Swordmaster class line don't have Paralyze-Escape or Paralyze-Counter passive skills and you want their only counter skill to be nerfed lol.
as for Hyper Drive no it doesn't need nerfing that skill is already Locked at 20 Max Bubbles with Low Damage (3k per hit lol) and Gladiator Bubble is hard to gain because it needs effort and it has cooldown lmaoo


I would agree with you on Moonlord and Dark Avenger those 2 needs hard nerfing
Eclipse iFrame should change to SA it's retardedly op. Literally cancels everything and then they throw you the tornado and game over for you.
Crescent Cleave just reduce the damage lol. Moon Blade Dance doesn't need Nerfing thou.

Yes. Avenger Force(30s) needs higher cooldown and put a condition of needing for it to hit to gain the bubble like Gladiators Brave(35s)
and Remove the COOLDOWN PLATE because that shiii can be CD plate.

Dark Riser SA should be on Flying Swing. Dark Riser SA is high af.

and Put a cooldown on Recover (DA's Mini Iron Skin) this skill doesn't have a cooldown. Like SA doesn't matter in PvP wtf ED

The only problem with DA and Moonlord is how easy for them to get Bubbles and use their Ace Skills.
MBD is Spammable because Moonlord just need to spam MLS or any ML tree skills to gain bubbles. atleast they should put a condition of "Hit-Gain" same goes for Avenger Force

While the other warrior class have condition on their bubbles.

Make these 2 gay class fight like a man


I hope they boost SA of Destroyers because their awakening skills can be easily cancelled like wtf. If DA's Dark Riser have Action Speed Plate. Destroyers should have too for their flying swing.

I don't regularly throw shade on the forums but, sorry to say this bruh, with that being said, u should not give any recommendations, and gitgud from your only gladiator instead. You clearly show you have personal bias on your own class so no, you the one you should stop and your non credible opinions, thank.

[Kazemon03]

I'm against to those nerf changes you want. The only thing I want them to change is the damage output of some class especially Dark Avenger and Moonlord.

Nerf so that it can be Possible to dodge by "Human Reaction Time"? You lack PVP experience.

Another thing is that they keep also reducing damage output of characters that do not need it which is annoying like in recent patch to what they do to DS. And you saying Chain Claw space bar trigger action to be removed? Lol. Every skill has it's own specialty.

The real deal is the Damage Output and Cooldown of some skills.

[ErickEych]

I'm against to those nerf changes you want. The only thing I want them to change is the damage output of some class especially Dark Avenger and Moonlord.

Nerf so that it can be Possible to dodge by "Human Reaction Time"? You lack PVP experience.

Another thing is that they keep also reducing damage output of characters that do not need it which is annoying like in recent patch to what they do to DS. And you saying Chain Claw space bar trigger action to be removed? Lol. Every skill has it's own specialty.

The real deal is the Damage Output and Cooldown of some skills.

i lack pvp experience ha ha ha ha ha ure right coz im a brown rank and ur a high rank ha ha ha ha ha
we need more of u in this community we need more damage and lowered cd skills hahhahahah

[[SPeanut]s]

[Majesty]
> [Awakened] Teleport : reduce aoe lol
> Grav Ass: knock down on first tick, slow and dmg on the rest
> Mirror: remove tiks

[Saleana]
> Rolling Lava EX : add a delay on the left click

[Smasher]
> Ninetail: remove ctc lol
> Mirror: gib her da tiks

[Gladiator]
> [Awakened] Parry : double the cd
> [Awake Skill] Hyper Drive : Reduce SAB and remove iframe
> Front Shove : reduce sab and increase cd
> Tripple slash: reduce the sa and slightly reduce the vertical aoe
> Counter exile: reduce the dmg and sab

[Moonlord]
> [Awakened] Eclipse : reduce iframe and sab :v
> Crescent Cleave EX : Give this skill the hit limit then its fixed
> cyclone slash: suction reduction action

[Dark Summoner]
> Phantom Claw: remove the sab increase ffs
> Chain Claw aerial cast is nothing :v
> Blitz claw increased cd (?)


i remembered idgaf and so i end, there was never a time pvp was balanced so it being broken is perfectly normal tbh

[[SPeanut]s]

its a feature

[ErickEych]

im giving up with this bye everyone lol